12 comments

  • boothby 44 minutes ago
  • wrxd 52 minutes ago
    Need more details. Any Googler willing to create a throwaway account and tell us what's going on?
  • andreapaiola 19 minutes ago
    Ok, I'll say it. The news is: "AI is not that powerful or functional". Sure, can change some little things but not that much. And we are overspending on it.
    • iamnothere 3 minutes ago
      This is my expectation. “We are overspending on AI and we’re going to destroy the company and maybe the economy” is less sensational than the end of the world, but it seems much more realistic.
    • lisplist 6 minutes ago
      I really don't understand how so many are so far detached from reality. Maybe AI hasn't revolutionized much of the physical world (yet), but its impacts to the digital world are profound, sweeping, and impossible to ignore.
    • azan_ 17 minutes ago
      I get people who said things like that like year ago, but nowadays it's a laughable position. Solving millenium problem means nothing nowadays? Exponential increase in CVE is nothing?
      • officeplant 14 minutes ago
        >Exponential increase in CVE is nothing?

        AI solving the problem it created? Woaow, the future is now!

        • zbentley 12 minutes ago
          I’m mostly bearish on AI, but this is flat wrong. The vast majority of CVEs that have been discovered with AI assistance were in code written long before AIs arrived on the scene.
      • nullsanity 15 minutes ago
        [dead]
      • tantalor 15 minutes ago
        The point is it's not AGI, and won't be for a long time.
        • adrianN 7 minutes ago
          The automatic loom wasn’t AGI either, but it replaced a lot of jobs.
        • dotancohen 11 minutes ago
          It doesn't have to be

          AGI can define goalposts that move every time A not-G I achieves a new milestone. That's fine. No matter what acronym you use to define it, artificial intelligence is objectively augmenting humans at the very edge of technology and science.

  • K3UL 41 minutes ago
    So in the article it says : - a former employee did it with no consequences - executives said they won't enforce it

    The article is just about them asking for changing the wording of contracts, not some super secret stuff they're dying to say and really can't.

    Without the paywall: https://archive.is/fKI3D

  • 0gs 18 minutes ago
    truly surprised nobody here is claiming this is a marketing op. it's the same thing as jacob coxon, right?
  • ricksunny 23 minutes ago
    from TFA, I liked seeing this, considering how influential Google HR policy choices are across the valley and beyond: “Recently, we’ve updated our terms for new hires, which included removing the post-termination aspect of non-disparagement clauses.”
  • dachworker 42 minutes ago
    Haven't we already heard the worst of it? If you let a swarm of agents on the loose with a goal, they will get to all kind of nefarious activity in pursuit of that goal. What could possibly be worse than that?
    • mattlondon 8 minutes ago
      A swarm of OpenAI and Anthropic agents have yes.

      I think there was some example of DeepMind models doing it, but under the control of a third party pen tester and the models stopped themselves.

      Everyone hates on Google but they seem fairly competent at infra stuff. I don't think we've heard of any google-controlled (not third party using a Google model) felonies like we have from OpenAI and Anthropic?

      Perhaps this is why we have not heard though!

    • reducesuffering 41 minutes ago
      That the agent swarm recursively improves powerful enough and the extinction of all humans is a side effect of that goal.
      • iamnothere 37 minutes ago
        If that’s the reality, you would think that employees would be willing to break an NDA for it. “We’re all going to die, but I really need my bonus this year” seems like a parody rather than a real strongly held position.

        If anything this points to a more moderate (but still bad) worry among the employees.

        • matmann2001 26 minutes ago
          I suppose there may be a bit of a prisoner's dilemma to it. Single voices can be discredited. It would take a coordinated disclosure to actually make the message stick.
        • latentsea 34 minutes ago
          > “We’re all going to die, but I really need my bonus this year” seems like a parody rather than a real strongly held position.

          We have been living in a parody for some time now, so it feels normal.

        • AndrewKemendo 30 minutes ago
          “We’re all going to die, but I really need my bonus this year”

          Is probably the best description of the state of engineering today

      • dachworker 34 minutes ago
        That's sci-fi. They cannot "recursively improve". There is no magic to LLMs. An agent swarm can increase it's thinking power by increasing the number of agents, the thinking time and by changing the base model to a more powerful one. So at worst they can assign themselves more compute or hijack another agent swarm based on a more powerful model.
        • gjskngnf 17 minutes ago
          LLMs today are improved by experiments that assay their performance, changes to architecture, pretraining, and post-training. None of those steps necessarily require humans. Welcome to your sci fi future.
          • dachworker 1 minute ago
            The implicit understanding of recursive improvement is that there is some step change increase in capability that only a superior intelligence will be able to achieve.

            A model being able to train a bigger model with marginally better capabilities is not what the hype was about.

        • pixl97 30 minutes ago
          Sorry bro, we live in a sci-fi world. I don't know what you think recursive improvement is, but we've been doing it for some time with models making synthetic data models and using it to train the next model. This is being done inside the labs intentionally to avoid as many employees and humans in post training. Works very well for things like math and cyber-sec.
          • jgalt212 24 minutes ago
            Yes, works great for anything that is amenable to reinforcement learning. For other domains, not so much.
          • ToucanLoucan 23 minutes ago
            > I don't know what you think recursive improvement is

            The ability for a model to improve itself over time without outside intervention. As yet, no models yet have this capability, and LLMs specifically what with how they are constructed, are not likely to ever have it. They are frozen in carbonite at the time of their training.

            That's not to say they can't use skills to appear somewhat worldly, things like searching the internet and what have you, but if you ask a model to strictly stick to data in it's training, it will do that and it will be stuck in whatever time in which it was built.

            Energy is conserved, gravity exists, and LLMs aren't intelligent.

        • delichon 12 minutes ago
          > They cannot "recursively improve"

          ... says a replicator built by evolution.

  • thm 35 minutes ago
  • unified101 52 minutes ago
    They should quit and warn. Anything else is hypocritical.
    • vanderZwan 11 minutes ago
      The contract apparently includes a clause that quitting doesn't release them from the NDA
    • ktm5j 45 minutes ago
      They likely signed non-disclosure agreements, breaking one of those could be a career-ender.
      • iamnothere 40 minutes ago
        If they’re not willing to break an NDA for it, it can’t be all that serious.
        • DangitBobby 33 minutes ago
          You'd be willing to destroy your career to publish a warning no one will need?
          • gradstudent 23 minutes ago
            You mean, no other evilcorp will hire them afterwards?
          • jmount 25 minutes ago
            Not me. But these are all "most important people in the world." So should fit their own narrative.
            • DangitBobby 21 minutes ago
              This entire line of reasoning is just toxic. You represent a charicature of these people in your head and dole out self-righteous condemnation.
          • bilbo0s 23 minutes ago
            Just, Devil's Advocate, but what would be the benefit of your career if all humans (or even just a few billions of humans) are going to die?

            I think it's reasonable to assume that if it's not worth breaking the NDA, it's likely not an existential threat for the vast majority of humanity.

            Now, does that mean that people who currently work upper-middle class knowledge work jobs aren't in for an exceedingly harsh economic reality check? Absolutely not.

            But that's not really as serious as an existential threat to humanity.

            • DangitBobby 16 minutes ago
              I doubt you are asking in good faith, because I suspect a good faith interlocutor would have worked this out on their own, but I'll proceed anyway.

              On the one hand, you've potentially got an indeterminate number of future comfortable years based on a subjective assessment of how long you think it takes catastrophe to materialize, with the downside that you can't warn anyone and so no one will stop the coming catastrophe.

              On the other hand you've got the immediate assurance of your current career being gone and high likelihood that you'll struggle financially as a result, with the upside that you can provide a warning to the public that they will almost certainly ignore and catastrophe comes anyway.

              Given the risk/reward assessment of those two options, what do you pick?

              • bilbo0s 3 minutes ago
                >Given the risk/reward assessment of those two options, what do you pick?

                Listen, I understand that, owing very likely to our differing backgrounds, you and I think differently.

                Where threats are concerned, I'm a simple soldier and as such I see things simply.

                I would raise the alarm without a second thought. I honestly don't know how anyone could reasonably believe they would have any other option?

        • ktm5j 7 minutes ago
          Maybe they are willing to break the NDA and they're just trying to go this route first.
        • mschuster91 19 minutes ago
          Look what happened to many people who broke NDAs or helped to do so. Snowden is stuck in Russia. Assange got holed up in an embassy for years. Sarah Wynn-Williams, the Facebook/Meta whistleblower, got an insane court order against her [1].

          Theoretically, retaliating against whistleblowers is seriously illegal stuff. But in practice these regulations are seldom enforced. And even if your (former) employer does not retaliate openly, there might still be "invisible" retaliation, or the risk of other large employers just blacklisting you by default.

          [1] https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cy42xgeq9vpo

          • iamnothere 6 minutes ago
            Breaking a Google NDA carries substantially less risk than leaking classified information, I imagine. And I would expect that someone exposing true existential risk would receive plenty of support in the face of civil suits. In any case, being more afraid of the courts than the end of humanity (if that’s what they want to leak) surely calibrates how strong their belief must be.
      • dastardly45 29 minutes ago
        NDAs will be void in the future when people wrestles back control from the corporate elite controlling so-called democracies
      • IncreasePosts 32 minutes ago
        If it's juicy enough presumably they could be an anonymous source for some journo. Which would still be breaking the NDA but good luck getting anywhere with that.
    • righthand 45 minutes ago
      But wait they don’t want to compromise their paycheck and opportunity to say they worked on the torment nexus. That would be uncool.
      • DangitBobby 33 minutes ago
        What if we displayed a modicum of good faith and grace
        • malfist 9 minutes ago
          Why would I display a modicum of good faith and grace when google has actively, at every chance, shown that they don't act in good faith. Hell today they announced if school districts turn off Google's ai for students they won't let them use google search either.
        • dogleash 1 minute ago
          One can display good faith and believe an interlocutor to be impugnable. It doesn't take a peer reviewed paper to prove that googlers should be viewed with suspicion. Also, if we did require that standard, we have the court documents that serve that purpose many times over.
        • righthand 24 minutes ago
          What if we displayed a modicum of truth and stopped pretending that Google employees don’t work there for the money? That is faithful and gracious to reality.
        • drcongo 25 minutes ago
          They work for Google.
  • noJiveTV 40 minutes ago
    How about:

    1. Full disclosure. 2. Run for your life. 3. Live in exile.

    • DangitBobby 34 minutes ago
      That doesn't seem to have the best track record for leading to positive change
  • Izikiel43 46 minutes ago
    I mean, they can do that, it’s not like google has kidnapped them.

    If they want to do that free of consequences, tough luck.

    • Noaidi 36 minutes ago
      Exactly, the title should read Google researchers are looking for their spines to tell the world how dangerous AI is.
  • Noaidi 37 minutes ago
    [flagged]
    • DangitBobby 28 minutes ago
      I think those two examples are a perfect demonstration of how futile it is to throw everything away to inform the public.